Rofflehaus talk:Proposed policies/Notability debate

From Rofflehaus

Contents 1 Notability 1.1 People notability 1.2 newbies, different, etc. 1.3 Freddie's $0.02

[edit] Notability

The point of my proposing notability is that I don't think articles about the fire hydrant on 6th street should have an article...nobody cares about it. Cburnett 00:53, 3 Jul 2005 (CDT)

Not sure what the notablitity purposal really says, but i think as a general rule we want to be fast and loose on the new pages. Inclusion rather then exlucsion should be a driving proposal.-- G_RAM

Someone cared enough to create the article. That seems to suggest at least a base lvl of intrest for one person. And its not like you are really forced to read it either. Let them have their backwater article if they want. --G_RAM

Someone need not have cared about it to have created it. Cburnett 00:57, 3 Jul 2005 (CDT)

If they had no intrest in it they would not have made it. --G_RAM

Edit wikipedia for while and you'll find there are lots of people that have nothing better to do than disrupt something. Do you think Ames is any different? :) Cburnett 01:00, 3 Jul 2005 (CDT)

I think it would be relativly easy to destingish between a distruption and a good faith effort to create an article that is either obscure, humorous, or satirical. Even if it is true that they only have a value too a small group. As long as they are not activly seeking to cause harm or damage to other people or articles why not encourage there contribution? Its a wiki we got unlimited space... why not use it? --G_RAM

At the moment, there's no rules or anything against total BS articles. Cburnett 01:10, 3 Jul 2005 (CDT)

Obscure is not bullshit. Some people like to make simple observations. Other people like to read them.

So rofflehaus is fair game for anything then? Cburnett 01:16, 3 Jul 2005 (CDT)

What is this fire hydrant article you're talking about? Is this an actual fire hydrant in Ames that has an interesting history? Or is this some stupid slang I'm not aware of? Seriously, if someone developed a fascination to a small and often neglected part of Ames, I don't think it's wrong for him/her to write about it and share that observation. If there's obviously malice and attempt to corrupt then of course that would be less tolerated.

No, there is absolutely nothing about that fire hydrant (that's my point). It's a fire hydrant. It has no history and it's just like any other fire hydrant. Besides, there's plenty of fire hydrants on 6th street. Cburnett 01:23, 3 Jul 2005 (CDT)

What if I write about the horse post in front of that one house around the downtown area? I'd say it's pretty interesting. Not very useful anymore, but people do use to tie their horses to this post... supposedly.

Whatever dude. You're arguing to argue. I'm not talking about a once-used-horse-post. I'm talking about a fire hydrant (or insert anything else here) that no one gives a damn about.

And please sign your posts. Cburnett 01:37, 3 Jul 2005 (CDT)

I'm not arguing. I'm genuinely asking to gauge what you/others think is acceptable or not. I made Time Capsules, for example, which I plan to make it into a comprehensive list of all time capsules in Ames/ISU, and perhaps some from the past that had already been opened. Does anyone care about this? Perhaps not a whole lot, but it's still somewhat worthy, I think. And I would sign my posts except that I don't know how to do it automatically and I don't feel like doing it manually.

I have no qualms with Time Capsules. They are notable and interesting. The fire hydrant on ____ street or the red pen I bought yesterday are so completely not worth having an article on them. Perhaps a better gauge for this is "if you can't write more than a few sentences on it, then it's not notable"? And real sentences; not "I bought a pen. It's red. It cost me $1.79 plus tax. I wrote a check with it today."

Ultimately I'm trying to flesh out an idea here that makes an article worth having. Is rofflehaus going to be a soap box where anyone can post anything about anything and say anything? Or can I write a tirade about how much I hate Bush? Can I post a picture of the penny I found on the sidewalk?

Or is it going to be a site with meaningful content about ISU and ISU-related and little else? Should personal anecdotes, stories, and biographies be left for user pages?

It's a big gray line and I think it should placed somewhere... Cburnett 03:03, 3 Jul 2005 (CDT)

I think the user pages could be used to contain a lot of what pussykats mentioned. Are you somehow automatically adding that time stamp to your edit burnett? --G_RAM

As far as I'm concerned, user pages can have whatever you want as long as it isn't offensive, etc.

Yes, you can add timestamps easily:

~~~

Cburnett

~~~~

Cburnett 13:01, 3 Jul 2005 (CDT)

~~~~~

13:01, 3 Jul 2005 (CDT)

I suppose a note should be made about that somewhere. Cburnett 13:01, 3 Jul 2005 (CDT)

To clarify my point, user pages as in "User:Cburnett" or "User:G-RAM" and not Dan Dunham or the like. See below discussion for people. Cburnett 13:24, 3 Jul 2005 (CDT)

Ok cool, i had been signing everything by hand, but i think i auctally signed the it out of habit to G_RAM not G-RAM. Oh well good to know. G-RAM 13:05, 3 Jul 2005 (CDT)

[edit] People notability

I think a person should have their own article if they've done something such that people would know them. Student org leaders, GSB folk, or streakers. I don't think Joe Bloe freshman from nowhere, IA needs his own page at Joe Bloe. If he wants a user page User:Joe Bloe then go ahead. Cburnett 13:24, 3 Jul 2005 (CDT)

[edit] newbies, different, etc.

As for the Notability proposal, I can understand each side of the argument. On the one hand, we don't want to stifle contributions. On the other, we don't want people wasting their own time writing about stuff that no one else will ever read again. I would like a policy about this, but it will take some thinking to come up with a good way to phrase this. --daoist 05:31, 4 Jul 2005 (CDT)

[edit] Freddie's $0.02

Spot on with the new users. Unless Joe Bloe was famous before/during/after he came to ISU, he can have a User:Joe Bloe just like the rest of us.

I think there needs to be some consistency with the notability. In this article, users are told to link anything that they deem worthy because You Never Know™ when it'll become relevant. If everything is linked, somebody will come along and make a page about it just because they can, which leads to meaningless stuff like, "I bought an ink pen and it cost $1.79, with tax." So wtf am I saying? Just use your judgement.

This isn't wikipedia, so I don't see the need to make it just like WP. --Freddie 01:39, 5 Jul 2005 (CDT)

Freedom 

No connection to ISU/Ames and best left to WP. Cburnett 22:53, 6 Jul 2005 (CDT)

Then why are you putting things like Michael Jackson's acquital, Deep Throat, and all that stuff in our calendar? Leave that to WP. --pussykatz 23:05, 6 Jul 2005 (CDT)

I'm not creating individual pages on each one of those. Besides, if you read what I wrote they give context ("backdrop" as daoist put it) to other things. Cburnett 23:18, 6 Jul 2005 (CDT)

Why not leave them? I dont see how they hurt anything. And if somebody wants a wikipedi article about them they can go there. I see no reason to exlude them here. G-RAM 23:36, 6 Jul 2005 (CDT)

I think it's rather silly (and not in a good way) to have articles which are just pale imitations of real articles in wikipedia. If something's related to ames or ISU, or something like that, then by all means go for it. Or hell, even if it's just pretty funny or something like that. but to just put up a halfassed explanation of something that:

• A. everyone already knows, and
• B. isn't the least bit interesting

Isn't much of a productive use of your time as a valuable editor or a reader's time either.

I'm not sure how we're going to resolve this difference since it seems that we've got two diametrically opposed camps. For the time being, all I can say is that everyone on both sides should keep monitoring the articles and nominating them for deletion if they are way outta scope, and keep monitoring the RH:VFD page to argue against deleting pages you feel are a valuable contribution to rofflehaus.

One thing you can do is fix articles that are VFD. add content that is either funny (and make it actually funny, not i'm just reaching so this article doesn't get deleted-funny), interesting, personalized for rofflehaus, or related to Ames or ISU in some way.--daoist 23:26, 7 Jul 2005 (CDT) --Freddie 05:03, 8 Jul 2005 (CDT)